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Author Topic: Changes in the weather....  (Read 548 times)

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Offline notatroll

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Changes in the weather....
« on: February 10, 2010, 09:21:03 PM »
Is it because of Global warming?  Is it just natural?  what do you think?   Here is what some think.....



Mark Twain had it right: Climate is what we expect; weather is what we get.

So, is the massive dumping of snow from the Mid-Atlantic to New England proof positive that climate change is untrue, as doubters such as Sen. James Imhofe (R-Okla.) have taken the opportunity to trumpet? (His family built an igloo, declared it Al Gore's new home and put up signs asking people to honk if they liked global warming).

Not if you read the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) report carefully.

First, the cold weather spells in the East have been linked with an "El Nino" year and a shift in the arctic oscillation that sent a jet of cold air down into the Eastern United States and elsewhere, all cyclically occurring events regardless of the overall trend in average planetary temperature, as the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration pointed out recently.

Lost in the hype over the East Coast cold snap around the Christmas holidays was the fact that at the same time, parts of Alaska were unseasonably warm. And the record cold that descended as far south as Florida in January? Globally, January 2010 was the warmest January on record, based on satellite data that date to 1979, according to AccuWeather.com.

As for East Coast getting snow in February, the IPCC scientists, citing peer-reviewed studies, concluded that the severity of precipitation events (and snow is one of them) would increase in a warming global climate.

The Union of Concerned Scientists, in a new backgrounder addressing recent controversies over the IPCC report, offers this:

"Between 1958 and 2007, New England saw a 67 percent increase in heavy precipitation events and the Midwest experienced a 31 percent increase, according to the 2009 federal report "Global Climate Change Impacts in the United States." The report documented a 20 percent average increase for the entire country.

To be sure, the IPCC has been forced to acknowledge errors and unsubstantiated statements in one of its landmark 2007 reports. The irregularities had to do with predictions of the expected effects of warming. None of them, however, undermined the report's consensus that the planet has warmed and that man's activities have contributed to the warming.

For instance, buried in the report was an unsubstantiated assertion that it was highly likely the Himalayan glaciers would be gone by 2035. The summary of the report was far less assertive. It said that "if current warming rates are maintained, Himalayan glaciers could decay at very rapid rates."

Some science on what's going on in Central Asia:

"Glacier retreat was dominant in the 20th century, except for a decade or two around 1970, when some glaciers gained mass and even reacted with re-advances of a few hundred metres. After 1980, ice loss and glacier retreat was dominant again. In Bhutan, Eastern
Himalaya, an eight per cent glacier area loss was observed between 1963 and 1993 (Karma et al. 2003). Berthier et al. (2007) used remote sensing data to investigate glacier thickness changes in the Himachal Pradesh, Western Himalaya. They found an annual ice thickness loss of about 0.8 m w.e. per year between 1999 and 2004 – about twice the long-term rate of the period 1977–1999."

That's from the United Nations Environmental Program's report on glaciers, based on the World Glacier Monitoring Service, participants in the IPCC process.

The doubters on global climate change, however, are not retreating like the majority of the globe's glaciers. Utah's House of Representatives on Monday passed a nonbinding resolution expressing its doubt about climate change. (The Beehive State, incidentally, also is considering opening up another radioactive waste site.)

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/greenspace/2010/02/snowmaggedon-in-washington-spurs-climate-change-doubters.html

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Offline Tony Light

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Re: Changes in the weather....
« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2010, 10:33:10 AM »
Nota, some folks want it both ways when it comes to global warming. Which means in my case I cant take them serious. democrat politicians are in that catagory including Robert Byrd. Forget the website I am going to post, just read what democrats have said about it one time and then see what they say other times.

http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/daily/site_021210/content/01125107.guest.html

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Offline Duke Jupiter

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Re: Changes in the weather....
« Reply #2 on: February 13, 2010, 12:57:28 PM »
Ole' Duke has talked to many folks concernin' global warming. Some dems and believe it or not some dadburn pubs thinks global warmin' is for real.
Best regards,
Duke (it ain't a pub and dem thing unless you make it to be one) Jupiter

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Re: Changes in the weather....
« Reply #3 on: February 13, 2010, 01:14:06 PM »
Who cares?  There is nothing we can do one way or the other.  Sure, we can make our planet cleaner, but that will not stop climate change.  It's always changed--always will.

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Offline Moonglow©

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Re: Changes in the weather....
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2010, 01:59:12 PM »
I'll take whatever I get. Been that way all my life.

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And I should be feeling what?

Offline notatroll

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Re: Changes in the weather....
« Reply #5 on: February 13, 2010, 04:09:51 PM »
I'll take whatever I get. Been that way all my life.

 I think we pretty much have to.  However it is still snowing here and I am truly starting to get cabin fever.

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Offline notatroll

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Re: Changes in the weather....
« Reply #6 on: February 13, 2010, 04:48:34 PM »
Global Warming Debate Heats Up in Wake of Record Snowstorms
By Blake Snow
 - FOXNews.com

Scientists and politicians on both sides of the climate change debate have been pointing to the record-breaking snowstorms in the Mid-Atlantic states to promote their theories on the earth's changing temperatures -- and the debate is getting downright nasty.


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AP Photo/Intelligencer Journal, Richard Hertzler

As snow-weary Pennsylvanians dug out, utilities struggled to restore power to thousands and crews worked to reopen closed roads after a record-breaking blizzard that dumped more than a foot of snow across the state.
Scientists and politicians on both sides of the climate change debate have been pointing to the record-breaking snowstorms in the Mid-Atlantic states to promote their theories on the earth's changing temperatures -- and the debate is getting downright nasty.

Joseph Romm, a climate change expert and former Energy Department official; Jeff Masters, a meteorologist who writes on the Weather Underground blog; and others argue that this winter's snowstorms are, counterintuitively, evidence of global warming and not cooling.

"It's absurd for the 'anti-science side' to say we're in a cooling trend when we're in an overall warming trend," says Romm of the Center for American Progress, a liberal think tank. "Heavy snow is not evidence that climate science is false," he added, noting that "the snow we've seen is entirely consistent with global warming theory."

But Patrick J. Michaels, senior fellow in environmental studies at the Cato Institute and state climatologist for Virginia for 27 years, disagrees. "Global warming simply hasn't done a darned thing to Washington's snow," he wrote on National Review, adding that "if you plot out year-to-year snow around here, you'll see no trend whatsoever through the entire history."

Politicians are jumping on the bandwagon, too. "It's going to keep snowing in DC until Al Gore cries 'uncle,'" tweeted Sen. Jim DeMint, R-S.C.

Global warming advocates feel under attack as skeptics use the record-setting snowstorms -- and the recent discoveries of errors in the U.N.'s climate science study, a growing scandal called climate-gate -- to question the theory that climate change is a manmade problem.

Romm explains that cold weather doesn't cause snow. What brings the flakes down is a combination of cold and precipitation. And since warmer air holds more moisture, global warming and heavy snowfall can coexist, so long as temperatures keeping dipping below 32 degrees.

Bill Nye, the Science Guy, agrees, going so far as to tell MSNBC's Rachel Maddow that scientists who doubt climate change's manmade origins are unpatriotic. "If you want to get serious about it, these guys claiming that the snow in Washington disproves climate change are almost unpatriotic -- it's as if they're denying science," Nye said.

And though the science debate heats up, unlike the weather, the snowstorms have set off even more questions: Why is the East Coast getting hit, while Vancouver needs to truck in snow for the Winter Olympics? Can we accurately link extreme weather with global warming?

Not really, says meteorologist Jeff Masters of Weather Underground, an independent forecaster. "You can't take regional events and link them to overall climate change," he said. "There's a huge amount of natural variance."

But some skeptics say the science isn't that innocent, even though they acknowledge global warming as a measurable anomaly. "As climate change critics, we're not denying an increase in temperature," says Dan Miller, publisher of the Heartland Institute, a group that favors free-market solutions to public policy problems. "We're skeptical of the crisis level and the cause."

Miller says climate-change scientists have a conflict of interest, as many stand to receive "a huge amount of money" from the government to support continued research. "There is no upper limit of money at stake," he warns.

Conversely, Miller says his firm is impartial, having no financial investment in climate change; it would lose a mere 4 percent of its funding if it ends up on the wrong side of the debate. "There's no money at stake for critics," he points out.

Masters says in a perfect world he'd need "200-300 years worth of records" to accurately predict further climate change. But since that's not available, "We're forced to make decisions on a limited data set." Nevertheless, Masters feels the possible dangers of global warming outweigh the risks of remaining idle. "We need to take action even in the face of inadequate data," he says.

Miller disagrees, arguing that we should collectively return to the drawing board -- in light of all the controversy, confusion, and potential conflicts of interest -- before we draw any conclusions.

"The science isn't settled," he says. "Yes, the climate has warmed -- that's not a hoax. But can't we go back and reconsider the science? Let's just step back and reconsider."
http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2010/02/12/reconciling-record-snow-storms-global-warming/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%253A+foxnews%252Fscitech+%2528Text+-+SciTech%2529

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Offline wvchat

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Re: Changes in the weather....
« Reply #7 on: February 13, 2010, 07:31:23 PM »
I'll take whatever I get. Been that way all my life.

 I think we pretty much have to.  However it is still snowing here and I am truly starting to get cabin fever.


Oh I totally have cabin fever.   The only thing good is the race tommorrow.  If it weren't for that I think I'd be going totally bonkers about now.

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Offline notatroll

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Re: Changes in the weather....
« Reply #8 on: February 13, 2010, 09:02:38 PM »
I'll take whatever I get. Been that way all my life.

 I think we pretty much have to.  However it is still snowing here and I am truly starting to get cabin fever.


Oh I totally have cabin fever.   The only thing good is the race tommorrow.  If it weren't for that I think I'd be going totally bonkers about now.

Tony will win! *18*

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Offline wvchat

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Re: Changes in the weather....
« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2010, 09:06:51 PM »
Not Likely.

Tell poo-poo head that the race is on Fox tomorrow. *devilish*

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Offline notatroll

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Offline Tony Light

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Re: Changes in the weather....
« Reply #11 on: February 14, 2010, 08:14:05 AM »
Has anyone been keeping up with the news that keeps coming out of the U.N. concerning global warming. It seems everyday they have to admit their data was wrong, or it wasnt science but GUESSES. This today.

U.N. climate panel admits Dutch sea level flaw
OSLO
Sat Feb 13, 2010 12:09pm ESTRelated NewsU.N. climate panel reviews Dutch sea level glitch
Fri, Feb 5 2010
U.N. climate chief rejects resigning over glacier gaffe

Sat, Jan 23 2010OSLO (Reuters) -

The U.N. panel of climate experts overstated how much of the Netherlands is below sea level, according to a preliminary report on Saturday, admitting yet another flaw after a row last month over Himalayan glacier melt.


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Offline notatroll

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Re: Changes in the weather....
« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2010, 08:32:40 AM »
Is Science not mainly made up of guesses?  They say it is fact, but daily something changes.  From safe medicines to what causes cancer.  Is it not just the theory of the day?

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Offline Graybeard

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Re: Changes in the weather....
« Reply #13 on: February 14, 2010, 08:43:45 AM »
Is Science not mainly made up of guesses?  They say it is fact, but daily something changes.  From safe medicines to what causes cancer.  Is it not just the theory of the day?


NO! True science is guesses that are our proven to be true. Things like the law of gravity,  etc. These things can be proven. Sadly, you are right about much of todays science. Opinions, especially one that can be profitable for the right people, are presented as science. Global warming is a perfect example of politicizing something that man may or may not be causing. Regardless, people and nations are lined up to make a fast buck from the hysteria, as evidenced recently in Denmark.

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Offline notatroll

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Re: Changes in the weather....
« Reply #14 on: February 14, 2010, 08:47:36 AM »
Once again it is all about the almighty $.  People used to do things because they wanted to help.....Now most everything is money based.

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